And they are not addressing the PHYSICAL TRAUMA of surgery. Yes it is a trauma to the body. Tissues are severed with knives and scalpels and other body parts are cut to add to the new creation. Intestines are sometimes used to create neo-vaginas. As Lisa has mentioned the complication rate is extremely high.
Are they telling the parents this?
Are they discussing orgasms with children who have never experienced an orgasm and have no idea what that is like?
Are parents making decisions about their child’s future lack of orgasms?
Where are the bioethicists?
To be clear, I do not know what gender identity means. I know that I was born a female baby. I was not assigned at birth. This is some kind of political language and I do not use it. I liked running in the woods in old clothes that were handed down from my brothers. I liked skiing fast. Oops, now you can identify me as privileged…
I liked arm-wrestling with boys.
Thank God nobody used the word gender other than a word to connote the sex of one human or another.
Yes I get it, I am old. I have no pronouns. I am not cis. I am a humanist. I am interested in humans and what they are interested in and not in what kind of sex they have.
What kind of art do you like?
Do you like art?
Do you like reading books?
Do you prefer fiction or nonfiction?
Do you like walking in the woods?
Do you like sitting at a busy café and sipping a flat-white?
Do you like mangoes?
What about roasted cauliflower?
Are you one of those people who say they hate musicals?
This is what I want to know.
Who are you?
I don’t care how you identify.
I do not know what that means.
If we go to the woods and make a small fire, do we have something to talk about?
That's one of the best comments about this issue that I've ever read, I'm not kidding! Wonderful list of questions, a way to really get to know what matters about a person. Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I'm with you 100 %! P.S. Yes! to roasted cauliflower, and mangoes!
“While I don’t want to ban books, I believe it’s fine, important even, for us to debate what’s age-appropriate.”
Thank you for saying this. Framing the issue of age appropriateness as “book banning” has always confused and frustrated me. But if we’re going to frame it as book banning, and book banning is bad, does it work the other way? Would liberal librarians and parents be ok with having “My Body is Me” by Rachel Rooney, which celebrates accepting the body you have, read to classes? Many school libraries have a section for parents with books about parenting and education. Would they allow Abigail Shrier’s “Irreversible Damage” to be available for parents to check out and read and let the parents make up their own minds about whether the book is transphobic or successfully makes the case for there being a transgender social contagion among girls?
" In fact, until recently, most liberals would have objected to teaching children that mermaids and princesses and dresses and pink are only for girls."
I still object!
And they didn't construct a vagina for her, they constructed a pouch between her legs. It does not lead to a uterus, ovaries or anything, it's not part of a reproductive system (or where one was if the person had a hysterectomy). They should stop lying about this.
And a "pouch" that has to be artificially dilated regularly, or it will close again. The body registers that "artificial vagina' as a wound and tries to heal it.
Exactly. Thank you for writing this and for making it public. This is definitely something to share with friends and with schools. A sympathetic and "progressive" friend of mine said to me the other day: "I don't know how it would feel to be in the wrong body", and I wanted to say "kids only feel like that because they are told that!" Take CJ, the gender non conforming boy who told his parents he was a girl, but they insisted that he was a boy and allowed him to dress and act in whatever way he chose (his mom wrote a book, something like "raising my rainbow"). This was some years ago, and his parents were celebrated by the "progressive" crowd. I bet now they would be called "transphobic bigots" by many of those same people...
Very good article, thank you, Lisa! About Jazz, sadly, I see him/her as a victim of societal and familial child abuse (imagine being okay with chronicling your child's very personal life and surgeries in a tv series!) So I highly question her parents' motives. In my view, the whole "trans" and "trans kids" agenda's take-over of modern society (in the US, for sure) was a definitive backlash against the gains of the LGB rights and women's movements. It was actually pretty naive to think there wouldn't be a big backlash. Trans here is similar in a way to what they do to gay men and lesbians in Iran, though supposedly not as a punishment like Iran -- it's a way to trans the gay away. That's what happened to Jazz. Dear little gender-non-conforming boy. It's a tragedy and a disgrace, though I feel nothing but sympathy and acceptance for Jazz, under the circumstances. Jaron Bloshinsky never had the chance to be himself and grow up into his natural body. Sorry for going on (obviously I feel strongly about this issue!) Keep doing what you're doing, much appreciated! P.S. I too remember Free To Be You and Me. It was a wonderful time, full of promise. Such a shame we've ended up like this.
Thank you for making this a public post. It strikes just the right note. I have already sent it to a few friends, and our household twitter maven (not me) has put two of your tweets of the this substack on twitter. I have also just listened to a "NowThis" of Biden's forum on trans rights: https://nowthisnews.com/news/nowthis-presidential-forum-biden-trans-rights It's clear he is not being adequately advised (as I saw it, he is conflating several issues into a single idea, with which I hope we all agree, that people who are trans should be enabled to have good lives, without harassment, and he also seems to be framing this as a partisan issue). I have taken the step now of calling Senator Gillibrand (one of my two Senators), advising I had watched the forum clip and was concerned that, while Biden's motive was laudable, important voices, notably those of women and mothers who are NOT right wing ideologues and who have many valid concerns, about, eg, the sex-based rights of women and girls and the medicalization of children presenting as gender-nonconforming, are not being heard. I recommended, and I hope you don't mind this, that she reach out to you, Lisa, and hear what you have to say. (Perhaps you've already tried this, but in the event.) The person with whom I spoke was respectful and did not seem to be dismissive. I'd like to recommend to anyone else here who has not done so to contact their Congresspeople on this.
Thanks for this comment! Good idea, encouraging people to contact their reps with Lisa's article. I've also sent emails during the last year or so to my three reps about the gender identity issue and have only gotten form-letter acknowledgments in response, as if they're avoiding the issue, which I think they are. I haven't spoken with anyone on the phone though, as I thought email was more concrete a record of my views. But phoning directly and talking to a staff member might be a good addition to emailing. And if we don't hear back properly from them to our emails, just send them again till we do. If they feel pestered, too bad. So if it's okay with Lisa, I will also email them with a link to her article or maybe even copy/paste the whole thing into the email (giving her credit of course) so they can't run away from it! Together we could get them to start dealing with the grim realities of all this. Wishing us all good luck!
Hey, Mildred: I like your thinking and ideas. FYI, I also have sent emails on a related issue to both my Senators and my Congressperson (Jerry Nadler). Got one form response, from Schumer. That's actually typical for him on the (few) issues I've raised over time--so I don't read anything into it except that it relates to the volume he gets. What was clear from the form response, though, is that the actual issue I was raising didn't register, as his form response was about his strong position in favor of women's rights. I do believe that the more people who speak up, the more likely it is to get on our elected officials's radar. email and calls are both good--one "puts it on the record," the other does that and also allows you to begin to educate/sensitize staff to the issues, too.
Hello Susan. Yes, I think my reps get lots of emails and calls, but what the heck, go for it anyway! We can only gain from trying. I've actually talked to HRC too (who I donated to at one point years ago and they wanted another donation) and Planned Parenthood and NPR and said what I thought of the current trans agenda and their support of it, especially as to children. A kindly person listened to me each time, they aren't the bosses, but it may have filtered up. I swear the young guy on the phone with NPR was about to say he agreed! These orgs need money, when all is said and done, so refusing to donate can have an impact (hopefully).
This is an excellent piece, as always Lisa. I really wish the movie, Palmer, with Justin Timberlake had gotten more attention. The little boy in that movie is an example of another way to raise a boy who likes girl things. I highly recommend it. It's so refreshing. The boy is obsessed with princesses and the idea of "trans" is never mentioned. The boy is bullied, yes, (and there's various family drama) but nobody tries to say this boy is a literal girl, everyone is encouraged to accept him as a unique and creative boy. If they had transed him, the movie probably would have been a hit. But since it was about actual literal acceptance of gender non-conformity, it didn't make many waves.
The book should not be removed from libraries. But someone really needs to write a children’s book where a de-transitioner is the main character. And detail the suffering and surgeries with nice colorful drawings.
As a parent of young kids, who have transitioned classmates in lower elementary school, I struggle with how to teach these concepts to my kids. ALL the books (and there are many, all read at my kids' school) treat social transition as a true solve, the family recognizes the child's real gender and the child grows up. Nothing about surgery, hormones, the psychological burden of growing up at war with your body. And many are so unscientific, saying things like the doctor made a mistake assigning sex at birth. And I feel like if there were books on the "opposite" side, they would be promoting sin and telling non conforming kids there was something wrong with not fulfilling traditional gender roles. It's super frustrating as a liberal parent who has concerns about what is best here, but who does not want to raise kids to think poorly of their peers or their families, all of whom are trying their best to navigate this strange new world.
I’ve thought a lot about how the YA books on this are really skewed toward one side and that it would be helpful to have a memoir from a detransitioner geared at tweens/teens. But it probably wouldn’t get published.
Thank you Lisa for your insights. This area is complex and emotionally charged for all of us. Years ago, when I was working as a child therapist, I learned that a small percentage of babies are born with “ambiguous” genitalia and are “assigned” a sex which is recorded on the birth certificate. I don’t know what the doctor parents are told by the doctor, but education is necessary, for the both the parents and the doctor. I second the call for bioethicists to educate all of us.
Yes but those kids are objectively recognizable as having a physical disorder. They aren't the same as nonconforming kids who are clearly physically perfectly fine.
Some doctors see “ambiguous” genitalia as a problem that needs correction. The idea of a “physical disorder” asserts a standard of “normal.” A child who believes she is a boy could be considered abnormal, but is she?
A child who believes she or he is the other sex isn't abnormal, but is it natural for a child to reject their own bodies? I've never been sure why doctors wouldn't also note that a baby was "yet to be determined" as to sex, if genitals are ambiguous, they're only tiny newborns, but does it have to matter so much what their sex is at that age? Or have a genetic test done early on, if it matters for health reasons. Otherwise, leave "ambiguous' genitalia alone. Our society is so messed up about sex and gender, worse now for sure. I agree, we all need education in ethics.
You are so right about the physical trauma of surgery, and that is a very important point. People tend to assume too quickly that because surgery is done in a medical setting and is sterile, it's not a big deal. Speaking as someone who has had heart surgery and a hysterectomy (at different times!!), it is a VERY big deal, even when there are no post-surgery complications.
I would be interested in anyone else's thoughts on how they might have handled this. I sent Lisa's Jaxx article to a fellow with whom I'm pretty good friends. He's ntelligent, thoughtful, a lot of good things. He hasn't replied directly to that--and it's possible he may not have seen it as of yet. But thinking he may have, and of a couple past exchanges with him, I had the following exchange, which transpired on reading an editorial on Biden's "Now This" on trans, in, of all things, the New York Post.
Me to him: What’s the worst about this is that the editorial has it correct. The guy Biden sat down with is a professional actor who figured out how to get attention. He’s a grifter adult who dresses up like a child. (In one Tik-tok, about menstrual products, he refers to “Barbie Pouches,” and I’ll just let you imagine what that means.) https://nypost.com/2022/10/24/why-did-president-biden-just-endorse-the-most-radical-trans-madness/ A LOT of left of center women are really pissed off (including our household). Now, what we can be sure of is that Biden is clueless—so the question is who advised him to walk into this trap? End of rant . . .
My friend replied: "Well, the clip you linked isn’t itself damning. If that’s a man in drag pretending to be trans, Joe Sixpack might well be fooled, or at best confused. Be interesting to see if this is given time on MSM news. I’ll look for it tonight. Maybe they’ll feature Charlie Crist’s takedown of DeSantis instead!"
To which I responded: "I am disappointed in you on this. I really thought you would see what is so, so wrong with this, or I wouldn’t have even tried. Look further, is all I can say. The link is to the Post article, BTW, not any of this narcissistic jerk’s tik-toks. Did you read the Selin Davis article I sent? What is happening in real time is that young people with many comorbidities that should sound alarms about mental health needs, are being castrated, having double mastectomies, and worse, in the name of “gender affirming” care, when actually, what many of them are are gender-nonconforming kids who would, if left alone medically and supported, would grow up gay. The NHS in England is getting the drift, finally, but here is Biden affirming the worst practices, and valorizing a perverted, narcissistic little drip who equates women’s vaginas with Barbie Pouches. C’mon, you’re smarter than this! Do your homework!"
I have some thoughts about the exchange, but I'll hold them back. Would be interested in anyone's thoughts.
Some very good news about the above exchange: I received the following reply from my friend:
"Apologies. I saw the clip but didn’t read the article, thinking the Post, being radical-right anyway, would only express delight in seeing Biden fooled. For once the Post sounds sane. . . . I was already, thanks to you, fully aware of the lunatic left’s sex-change mania, if not maybe the extent of it, and share your horror at butchering confused kids. My comments went to the effect on the midterms and Biden’s prospects, and I was, in fact, happy to see no mention of this debacle, or Biden’s ignorance, on the evening news. . . . What the sex-change advocates on the left are perpetrating is another, separate crisis, and one the left needs to take up with itself “in house.” Where they do that, what forum separate from the right wing’s own madness, is something I don’t know. I’d expect some big article in Atlantic or the New Yorker or Utne or Mother Jones or… let me know if you see one. (Or is that the Selin Davis article you say you sent but that I can’t find?) I guess if the left is going to have a forum on this, it would be in a magazine or two or five."
He then went on, on his own, to find an article by Lisa--in the New York Post (on the WPATH changes).
Among other things, what we see from this, once again, is that the failure of mainstream and left of center media to cover the gender-critical side of the debate is indeed slowing people down from getting information. Not surprisingly (and I do the same) as most of us do not have time to vet sources, we rely first and foremost on media outlets and spokespeople we at least generally trust, and avoid those we do not. You will see here that my friend, initially reluctant to trust anything from the NY Post (and this is my general view, too), read it because--and I think only because--of what I wrote him. On doing that, the veil was lifted. He found the article "sane."
Second, he is now aware of Lisa's work, and actually went to search out. I let him know she is writing from left-of-center, but has had a lot of trouble getting her work into MSM and left outlets. I believe, going forward, he will find Lisa a trusted source.
Last, as it turns out, the previous exchanges I'd had with him (these were not easy; I had to push, though not so hard as I did this time, to get him to pay attention to the issue) had actually "landed" much more than I could have hoped.
Which is all to say, it is worth it to try with friends and neighbors, one-on-one, to let the light on these issues shine in. And, above all, thank goodness for Lisa, to whom we can point as a trusted source NOT coming from the right, no matter in what outlet her work may appear.
"If that’s a man in drag pretending to be trans..." sounds an awful lot like "no true Scotsman" to me.
Any time you point at a particular Trans-Identifying Male acting like a "perverted, narcissistic little drip," that's the response - well, that's not a true Scotsman, er, Trans-Woman.
Send your friend a link to skirt go spinny's recent video. It might help him to see that this is all of a piece.
Hi, Friki: Yes, seemed an odd statement to me, too. BUT I am glad to say this had a very happy ending. I've described it in replies above to my original comment on this. Among other things, it confirms how much excellent information like Lisa's is lost or ignored because mainstream and left of center media don't pick it up. But it's also confirming that it's worth a try, though sometimes painful, to do one's best to alert and educate friends--and point them in Lisa's direction.
Testosterone is an anti depressant which might be part of it. Not one that should be used as such long term due to health risks as you say. 3 years is starting to be the range where they grow up enough to realize what they actually need(ed). Take care!
And they are not addressing the PHYSICAL TRAUMA of surgery. Yes it is a trauma to the body. Tissues are severed with knives and scalpels and other body parts are cut to add to the new creation. Intestines are sometimes used to create neo-vaginas. As Lisa has mentioned the complication rate is extremely high.
Are they telling the parents this?
Are they discussing orgasms with children who have never experienced an orgasm and have no idea what that is like?
Are parents making decisions about their child’s future lack of orgasms?
Where are the bioethicists?
To be clear, I do not know what gender identity means. I know that I was born a female baby. I was not assigned at birth. This is some kind of political language and I do not use it. I liked running in the woods in old clothes that were handed down from my brothers. I liked skiing fast. Oops, now you can identify me as privileged…
I liked arm-wrestling with boys.
Thank God nobody used the word gender other than a word to connote the sex of one human or another.
Why does everybody want a super-special identity?
Demisexual. Pansexual. Asexual. Eunuch. Nullo. Agender. Queer. Non-binary.
Yes I get it, I am old. I have no pronouns. I am not cis. I am a humanist. I am interested in humans and what they are interested in and not in what kind of sex they have.
What kind of art do you like?
Do you like art?
Do you like reading books?
Do you prefer fiction or nonfiction?
Do you like walking in the woods?
Do you like sitting at a busy café and sipping a flat-white?
Do you like mangoes?
What about roasted cauliflower?
Are you one of those people who say they hate musicals?
This is what I want to know.
Who are you?
I don’t care how you identify.
I do not know what that means.
If we go to the woods and make a small fire, do we have something to talk about?
Let’s try that.
Thank you Lisa Selin Davis.
That's one of the best comments about this issue that I've ever read, I'm not kidding! Wonderful list of questions, a way to really get to know what matters about a person. Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I'm with you 100 %! P.S. Yes! to roasted cauliflower, and mangoes!
Thank you Mildred.
“While I don’t want to ban books, I believe it’s fine, important even, for us to debate what’s age-appropriate.”
Thank you for saying this. Framing the issue of age appropriateness as “book banning” has always confused and frustrated me. But if we’re going to frame it as book banning, and book banning is bad, does it work the other way? Would liberal librarians and parents be ok with having “My Body is Me” by Rachel Rooney, which celebrates accepting the body you have, read to classes? Many school libraries have a section for parents with books about parenting and education. Would they allow Abigail Shrier’s “Irreversible Damage” to be available for parents to check out and read and let the parents make up their own minds about whether the book is transphobic or successfully makes the case for there being a transgender social contagion among girls?
Thank you!!
" In fact, until recently, most liberals would have objected to teaching children that mermaids and princesses and dresses and pink are only for girls."
I still object!
And they didn't construct a vagina for her, they constructed a pouch between her legs. It does not lead to a uterus, ovaries or anything, it's not part of a reproductive system (or where one was if the person had a hysterectomy). They should stop lying about this.
And a "pouch" that has to be artificially dilated regularly, or it will close again. The body registers that "artificial vagina' as a wound and tries to heal it.
Exactly. Thank you for writing this and for making it public. This is definitely something to share with friends and with schools. A sympathetic and "progressive" friend of mine said to me the other day: "I don't know how it would feel to be in the wrong body", and I wanted to say "kids only feel like that because they are told that!" Take CJ, the gender non conforming boy who told his parents he was a girl, but they insisted that he was a boy and allowed him to dress and act in whatever way he chose (his mom wrote a book, something like "raising my rainbow"). This was some years ago, and his parents were celebrated by the "progressive" crowd. I bet now they would be called "transphobic bigots" by many of those same people...
Very good article, thank you, Lisa! About Jazz, sadly, I see him/her as a victim of societal and familial child abuse (imagine being okay with chronicling your child's very personal life and surgeries in a tv series!) So I highly question her parents' motives. In my view, the whole "trans" and "trans kids" agenda's take-over of modern society (in the US, for sure) was a definitive backlash against the gains of the LGB rights and women's movements. It was actually pretty naive to think there wouldn't be a big backlash. Trans here is similar in a way to what they do to gay men and lesbians in Iran, though supposedly not as a punishment like Iran -- it's a way to trans the gay away. That's what happened to Jazz. Dear little gender-non-conforming boy. It's a tragedy and a disgrace, though I feel nothing but sympathy and acceptance for Jazz, under the circumstances. Jaron Bloshinsky never had the chance to be himself and grow up into his natural body. Sorry for going on (obviously I feel strongly about this issue!) Keep doing what you're doing, much appreciated! P.S. I too remember Free To Be You and Me. It was a wonderful time, full of promise. Such a shame we've ended up like this.
Thank you for making this a public post. It strikes just the right note. I have already sent it to a few friends, and our household twitter maven (not me) has put two of your tweets of the this substack on twitter. I have also just listened to a "NowThis" of Biden's forum on trans rights: https://nowthisnews.com/news/nowthis-presidential-forum-biden-trans-rights It's clear he is not being adequately advised (as I saw it, he is conflating several issues into a single idea, with which I hope we all agree, that people who are trans should be enabled to have good lives, without harassment, and he also seems to be framing this as a partisan issue). I have taken the step now of calling Senator Gillibrand (one of my two Senators), advising I had watched the forum clip and was concerned that, while Biden's motive was laudable, important voices, notably those of women and mothers who are NOT right wing ideologues and who have many valid concerns, about, eg, the sex-based rights of women and girls and the medicalization of children presenting as gender-nonconforming, are not being heard. I recommended, and I hope you don't mind this, that she reach out to you, Lisa, and hear what you have to say. (Perhaps you've already tried this, but in the event.) The person with whom I spoke was respectful and did not seem to be dismissive. I'd like to recommend to anyone else here who has not done so to contact their Congresspeople on this.
That's a great idea!!!
Thanks for this comment! Good idea, encouraging people to contact their reps with Lisa's article. I've also sent emails during the last year or so to my three reps about the gender identity issue and have only gotten form-letter acknowledgments in response, as if they're avoiding the issue, which I think they are. I haven't spoken with anyone on the phone though, as I thought email was more concrete a record of my views. But phoning directly and talking to a staff member might be a good addition to emailing. And if we don't hear back properly from them to our emails, just send them again till we do. If they feel pestered, too bad. So if it's okay with Lisa, I will also email them with a link to her article or maybe even copy/paste the whole thing into the email (giving her credit of course) so they can't run away from it! Together we could get them to start dealing with the grim realities of all this. Wishing us all good luck!
Let me know if you get a response!
Hey, Mildred: I like your thinking and ideas. FYI, I also have sent emails on a related issue to both my Senators and my Congressperson (Jerry Nadler). Got one form response, from Schumer. That's actually typical for him on the (few) issues I've raised over time--so I don't read anything into it except that it relates to the volume he gets. What was clear from the form response, though, is that the actual issue I was raising didn't register, as his form response was about his strong position in favor of women's rights. I do believe that the more people who speak up, the more likely it is to get on our elected officials's radar. email and calls are both good--one "puts it on the record," the other does that and also allows you to begin to educate/sensitize staff to the issues, too.
Hello Susan. Yes, I think my reps get lots of emails and calls, but what the heck, go for it anyway! We can only gain from trying. I've actually talked to HRC too (who I donated to at one point years ago and they wanted another donation) and Planned Parenthood and NPR and said what I thought of the current trans agenda and their support of it, especially as to children. A kindly person listened to me each time, they aren't the bosses, but it may have filtered up. I swear the young guy on the phone with NPR was about to say he agreed! These orgs need money, when all is said and done, so refusing to donate can have an impact (hopefully).
This is an excellent piece, as always Lisa. I really wish the movie, Palmer, with Justin Timberlake had gotten more attention. The little boy in that movie is an example of another way to raise a boy who likes girl things. I highly recommend it. It's so refreshing. The boy is obsessed with princesses and the idea of "trans" is never mentioned. The boy is bullied, yes, (and there's various family drama) but nobody tries to say this boy is a literal girl, everyone is encouraged to accept him as a unique and creative boy. If they had transed him, the movie probably would have been a hit. But since it was about actual literal acceptance of gender non-conformity, it didn't make many waves.
The book should not be removed from libraries. But someone really needs to write a children’s book where a de-transitioner is the main character. And detail the suffering and surgeries with nice colorful drawings.
Kids read and enjoy horror books.
As a parent of young kids, who have transitioned classmates in lower elementary school, I struggle with how to teach these concepts to my kids. ALL the books (and there are many, all read at my kids' school) treat social transition as a true solve, the family recognizes the child's real gender and the child grows up. Nothing about surgery, hormones, the psychological burden of growing up at war with your body. And many are so unscientific, saying things like the doctor made a mistake assigning sex at birth. And I feel like if there were books on the "opposite" side, they would be promoting sin and telling non conforming kids there was something wrong with not fulfilling traditional gender roles. It's super frustrating as a liberal parent who has concerns about what is best here, but who does not want to raise kids to think poorly of their peers or their families, all of whom are trying their best to navigate this strange new world.
I’ve thought a lot about how the YA books on this are really skewed toward one side and that it would be helpful to have a memoir from a detransitioner geared at tweens/teens. But it probably wouldn’t get published.
Thank you Lisa for your insights. This area is complex and emotionally charged for all of us. Years ago, when I was working as a child therapist, I learned that a small percentage of babies are born with “ambiguous” genitalia and are “assigned” a sex which is recorded on the birth certificate. I don’t know what the doctor parents are told by the doctor, but education is necessary, for the both the parents and the doctor. I second the call for bioethicists to educate all of us.
Yes but those kids are objectively recognizable as having a physical disorder. They aren't the same as nonconforming kids who are clearly physically perfectly fine.
Some doctors see “ambiguous” genitalia as a problem that needs correction. The idea of a “physical disorder” asserts a standard of “normal.” A child who believes she is a boy could be considered abnormal, but is she?
A child who believes she or he is the other sex isn't abnormal, but is it natural for a child to reject their own bodies? I've never been sure why doctors wouldn't also note that a baby was "yet to be determined" as to sex, if genitals are ambiguous, they're only tiny newborns, but does it have to matter so much what their sex is at that age? Or have a genetic test done early on, if it matters for health reasons. Otherwise, leave "ambiguous' genitalia alone. Our society is so messed up about sex and gender, worse now for sure. I agree, we all need education in ethics.
You are so right about the physical trauma of surgery, and that is a very important point. People tend to assume too quickly that because surgery is done in a medical setting and is sterile, it's not a big deal. Speaking as someone who has had heart surgery and a hysterectomy (at different times!!), it is a VERY big deal, even when there are no post-surgery complications.
I would be interested in anyone else's thoughts on how they might have handled this. I sent Lisa's Jaxx article to a fellow with whom I'm pretty good friends. He's ntelligent, thoughtful, a lot of good things. He hasn't replied directly to that--and it's possible he may not have seen it as of yet. But thinking he may have, and of a couple past exchanges with him, I had the following exchange, which transpired on reading an editorial on Biden's "Now This" on trans, in, of all things, the New York Post.
Me to him: What’s the worst about this is that the editorial has it correct. The guy Biden sat down with is a professional actor who figured out how to get attention. He’s a grifter adult who dresses up like a child. (In one Tik-tok, about menstrual products, he refers to “Barbie Pouches,” and I’ll just let you imagine what that means.) https://nypost.com/2022/10/24/why-did-president-biden-just-endorse-the-most-radical-trans-madness/ A LOT of left of center women are really pissed off (including our household). Now, what we can be sure of is that Biden is clueless—so the question is who advised him to walk into this trap? End of rant . . .
My friend replied: "Well, the clip you linked isn’t itself damning. If that’s a man in drag pretending to be trans, Joe Sixpack might well be fooled, or at best confused. Be interesting to see if this is given time on MSM news. I’ll look for it tonight. Maybe they’ll feature Charlie Crist’s takedown of DeSantis instead!"
To which I responded: "I am disappointed in you on this. I really thought you would see what is so, so wrong with this, or I wouldn’t have even tried. Look further, is all I can say. The link is to the Post article, BTW, not any of this narcissistic jerk’s tik-toks. Did you read the Selin Davis article I sent? What is happening in real time is that young people with many comorbidities that should sound alarms about mental health needs, are being castrated, having double mastectomies, and worse, in the name of “gender affirming” care, when actually, what many of them are are gender-nonconforming kids who would, if left alone medically and supported, would grow up gay. The NHS in England is getting the drift, finally, but here is Biden affirming the worst practices, and valorizing a perverted, narcissistic little drip who equates women’s vaginas with Barbie Pouches. C’mon, you’re smarter than this! Do your homework!"
I have some thoughts about the exchange, but I'll hold them back. Would be interested in anyone's thoughts.
Some very good news about the above exchange: I received the following reply from my friend:
"Apologies. I saw the clip but didn’t read the article, thinking the Post, being radical-right anyway, would only express delight in seeing Biden fooled. For once the Post sounds sane. . . . I was already, thanks to you, fully aware of the lunatic left’s sex-change mania, if not maybe the extent of it, and share your horror at butchering confused kids. My comments went to the effect on the midterms and Biden’s prospects, and I was, in fact, happy to see no mention of this debacle, or Biden’s ignorance, on the evening news. . . . What the sex-change advocates on the left are perpetrating is another, separate crisis, and one the left needs to take up with itself “in house.” Where they do that, what forum separate from the right wing’s own madness, is something I don’t know. I’d expect some big article in Atlantic or the New Yorker or Utne or Mother Jones or… let me know if you see one. (Or is that the Selin Davis article you say you sent but that I can’t find?) I guess if the left is going to have a forum on this, it would be in a magazine or two or five."
He then went on, on his own, to find an article by Lisa--in the New York Post (on the WPATH changes).
Among other things, what we see from this, once again, is that the failure of mainstream and left of center media to cover the gender-critical side of the debate is indeed slowing people down from getting information. Not surprisingly (and I do the same) as most of us do not have time to vet sources, we rely first and foremost on media outlets and spokespeople we at least generally trust, and avoid those we do not. You will see here that my friend, initially reluctant to trust anything from the NY Post (and this is my general view, too), read it because--and I think only because--of what I wrote him. On doing that, the veil was lifted. He found the article "sane."
Second, he is now aware of Lisa's work, and actually went to search out. I let him know she is writing from left-of-center, but has had a lot of trouble getting her work into MSM and left outlets. I believe, going forward, he will find Lisa a trusted source.
Last, as it turns out, the previous exchanges I'd had with him (these were not easy; I had to push, though not so hard as I did this time, to get him to pay attention to the issue) had actually "landed" much more than I could have hoped.
Which is all to say, it is worth it to try with friends and neighbors, one-on-one, to let the light on these issues shine in. And, above all, thank goodness for Lisa, to whom we can point as a trusted source NOT coming from the right, no matter in what outlet her work may appear.
"If that’s a man in drag pretending to be trans..." sounds an awful lot like "no true Scotsman" to me.
Any time you point at a particular Trans-Identifying Male acting like a "perverted, narcissistic little drip," that's the response - well, that's not a true Scotsman, er, Trans-Woman.
Send your friend a link to skirt go spinny's recent video. It might help him to see that this is all of a piece.
Hi, Friki: Yes, seemed an odd statement to me, too. BUT I am glad to say this had a very happy ending. I've described it in replies above to my original comment on this. Among other things, it confirms how much excellent information like Lisa's is lost or ignored because mainstream and left of center media don't pick it up. But it's also confirming that it's worth a try, though sometimes painful, to do one's best to alert and educate friends--and point them in Lisa's direction.
Thanks for sharing this perspective!
Testosterone is an anti depressant which might be part of it. Not one that should be used as such long term due to health risks as you say. 3 years is starting to be the range where they grow up enough to realize what they actually need(ed). Take care!